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04-19-2003, 02:53 AM   PM User | #31
jkd
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Quote:
 Originally posted by mattover-matter Yes, infinite. Moves can be retraced over and over
Board position can't be repeated three times in a row. Otherwise, it is a draw.

Draws typically also occur when it can be shown that a player can prolong a game indefinitely by repeating a cycle of moves.

Finite.
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 04-20-2003, 03:51 AM PM User | #32 mattover-matter Banned   Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 224 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts oh no, its jkd. I better just step out and agree with him
04-20-2003, 04:09 AM   PM User | #33
jkd
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Quote:
 Originally posted by mattover-matter oh no, its jkd. I better just step out and agree with him
Or you could think about why there are a finite number of games and learn something.

Assuming nonintelligent players who don't mind playing forever, an untimed game could proceed for eternity. What often happens is that there may be an 8 move cycle or something that eventually forces the opponent back to where he started, and in doing so the player ends up where he started as well. Assuming no mistakes, this could continue forever. However, usually a draw is offered and accepted.

Now, also keep in mind that a checkmate is impossible with certain piece combinations. You can't mate with a king and a bishop or a king and a knight. I don't believe you can mate with two knights either. I think you can force mate with two bishops, and you certainly can force mate with a bishop and a knight (though it is lengthy). But games with minimal pieces like this can easily be declared a draw or a victory for someone, even though at first a mate may not seem possible.

This fact significantly reduces the amount of games that seem like they can go on forever.
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04-20-2003, 04:33 AM   PM User | #34
krycek
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Quote:
 Originally posted by mattover-matter oh no, its jkd. I better just step out and agree with him
mattover-matter.

I'm not the only one who is getting COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY FED UP OF YOU

jkd is a highly respected forum member, as well as being a super-moderator. The reason for both of these is that he knows what he is talking about - whereas YOU DON'T

jkd is not only a friend of mine but also someone I respect very highly as a programmer and mathematician. He's very rarely wrong, and it p!sses me off to see someone as ignorant as yourself mocking him. I think he deserves extra credit for being so patient and trying to help you!

He's only 17 himself and I believe he was a mod at 13 - I cannot imagine you doing that because you have (a) an enormous lack of maturity, and (b) a shocking lack of respect.

Almost every day your name comes up in conversations that people have with me; usually in context with the word "annoying". I think you need to grow up FAST or else decrease even more in popularity here (if such a thing is possible).

Now, shut up and p!ss off and stop implying that you know more than experienced gurus.

::] krycek [::
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04-20-2003, 08:21 AM   PM User | #35
mattover-matter
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what is with you? I did not flame or put-down jkd. I never said he did not know what he was talking about, and I never said I did. Maybe you should think about what you say before you say it.

Quote:
 (a) an enormous lack of maturity, and (b) a shocking lack of respect
Are you determining my personal attributes from a few typed words? I think you need to logically look at that for a second.

 04-20-2003, 11:18 AM PM User | #36 missing-score Senior Coder     Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: UK Posts: 2,194 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts trust me matt, it's not just him __________________ PHP Weekly - A PHP Developers Resource PHP 5.1.4 and Ruby on Rails web hosting Moderator of PHP and Work offers and Requests Install Apache/PHP/MySQL (by marek_mar) | TinyPlugin Architecture
04-20-2003, 06:08 PM   PM User | #37
krycek
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Quote:
 Originally posted by mattover-matter what is with you? I did not flame or put-down jkd.
I think you were pretty sarcastic, and it wasn't just a once-off!
Quote:
 I never said he did not know what he was talking about, and I never said I did. Maybe you should think about what you say before you say it.
Believe me, I thought about it! You also had that coming to you for a while... I've held back from it but every time I saw a glib post of yours, it got closer until BOOM!
Quote:
 Are you determining my personal attributes from a few typed words? I think you need to logically look at that for a second.
It's YOU that portrays your personal attributes with 'a few typed words'. I don't know (or care) what you are like in real life. I only interact with you online, and as such, the 'personal attributes' you display leave a lot to be desired.

e.g.

- posting nonsense.
- taking the mick out of people/mocking them
- 'know-it-all' tone

And a few more similar things. They all add up to be ANNOYING.

::] krycek [::
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 04-20-2003, 08:45 PM PM User | #38 mattover-matter Banned   Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 224 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts I'm sorry that you feel that way about me. I guess I will take my leave then.
04-20-2003, 09:09 PM   PM User | #39
krycek
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Quote:
 Originally posted by mattover-matter I'm sorry that you feel that way about me. I guess I will take my leave then.
Instant reaction - yippee!

Second reaction - you don't have to go, you know.

The only reason you are disliked is because you are annoying.

If you cease being annoying, then it will no longer be a problem.

I for one will be rather disappointed to see you go, because to me that would say that you cannot change your behaviour. I would vastly prefer that you take the time to consider how you are coming across, and then proceed in a more suitable manner.

However if that is impossible then maybe it is best that you go.

::] krycek [::
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 04-20-2003, 09:19 PM PM User | #40 missing-score Senior Coder     Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: UK Posts: 2,194 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Yup, I agree... I think you (mattover-matter) could be a respected member if you change your attitude, you do seem to be good at programming, as advice you have given in other threads has been good. __________________ PHP Weekly - A PHP Developers Resource PHP 5.1.4 and Ruby on Rails web hosting Moderator of PHP and Work offers and Requests Install Apache/PHP/MySQL (by marek_mar) | TinyPlugin Architecture Last edited by missing-score; 04-20-2003 at 09:42 PM..
 04-20-2003, 10:23 PM PM User | #41 mattover-matter Banned   Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 224 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts I have given up on programmimg for a few years. It is too boring for me. I will continue creating campaigns in WCIII as I find the more enjoyable.
 04-21-2003, 02:59 AM PM User | #42 WA Administrator   Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 2,596 Thanks: 2 Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts Ok, obviously I don't condone any of the last few posts in this thread, which are all out-of-order in one way or the other. The best way to file a complaint is to PM me. However, this situation with Mattover-matter has been a long-standing one, and I've decided to suspend his account until further notice. Please get back to the original topic now. I might delete the last few posts here sometime this week when everyone's had a chance to see what has transpired. Thanks. __________________ - George - JavaScript Kit- JavaScript tutorials and 400+ scripts! - JavaScript Reference- JavaScript reference you can relate to.
04-22-2003, 03:20 AM   PM User | #43
Alex Vincent
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Quote:
 Originally posted by krycek PS - It is a constant mission to me to find jkd wrong at something. So far, I have succeeded only twice - and one of those was debateable...
It can be done, speaking from experience. But I do hear Mission: Impossible music playing in the background...

It's worth noting that the development of artificial intelligences for chess games has considered the possible number of moves in a game, and discarded it. It's far easier for the computer to throw away all moves following one move which it knows will not be optimal.
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