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View Poll Results: To IE6 or not to IE6?

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  • Maintain IE6 compatibility.

    11 73.33%
  • Forget IE6 and embrace CSS lovelyness.

    4 26.67%
Results 1 to 12 of 12
  1. #1
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    To IE6 or not to IE6?

    Hi all,

    First up, sorry if this has been done to death already - I did have a quick look at other threads but couldn't see anything specifically dealing with this issue, but I may have overlooked something - if I have just point me in the right direction...


    Anyway, here's the issue:

    I'm developing quite a sophisticated website, with a complex layout, lots of 'background images' and so on...

    Now, I could use good old table layouts, avoid image transparancies, and stick to the most basic of CSS to retain compatibility with IE6.

    Or, I could embrace CSS layout, transparent images and use the more advanced CSS features, but it will all look really hideous in IE6.

    So, to IE6 or not to IE6? That is the question.

    What do you people think?
    Last edited by Scorpion0x17; 10-19-2007 at 04:19 PM.

  • #2
    eak
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    Getting css layouts to work they way you want in IE6 can be difficult at times, but it is manageable. I would avoid table based layouts and just learn the workarounds / hacks for IE6.
    eak | "Doing a good deed is like wetting your pants; every one can see the results, but only you can feel the warmth."

  • #3
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    There are too many businesses that use old computers with old software and have no NEED to upgrade any time in the next couple of years, because the machines work just fine for what they need them in.

    Thus, as much as I hate it, I say maintain IE6. However, I'm about ready to kiss 800x600 goodbye for good. width:980px;, here i come!

  • #4
    The fat guy next door VIPStephan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpion0x17 View Post
    Now, I could use good old table layouts, avoid image transparancies, and stick to the most basic of CSS to retain compatibility with IE6.

    Or, I could embrace CSS layout, transparent images and use the more advanced CSS features, but it will all look really hideous in IE6.
    Third option: Do both. It might give you some headaches but almost anything is possible in IE6, too, if youíre good and patient enough. You might need conditional comments and/or JavaScript but if it helps itís good.

    And in the worst case you can still serve IE with a completely different stylesheet with a simpler layout (again, using conditional comments).

  • #5
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    Unhappy

    Thanks for your inputs.

    Unfortunately the kinds of 'brickwalls' I keep on hitting are those where there simply seems to be no easy work around for IE6.


    For example, I'd like to use graphical 'frames' around certain sections of (well, almost all) content.

    This can be done very easily with tables, spacer images and the most basic of CSS rules (using background-image's). Which give results that are compatible with both IE6 and, of course, better browsers.

    But, the forward-thinking purist in me wants to get away from using tables for this kind of thing and start using absolute positioned images/divs within relative positioned container divs.

    But IE6 chokes on the CSS and looks hideous.

    There are other examples, but this is the easiest to explain.


    Another I can illustrate with a link - take a look at this - this is quick test I put together to check IE6 behaviour when faced with certain advanced CSS selectors that I'd like to use - I knew IE6 wouldn't recognise them, and so it would fail to render 'correctly' - but I didn't expect it to fail in the way it does!

    Try it for yourself - view it first in Firefox/IE7 - take a look at the source - then try to guess what will happen in IE6... You may be surprised. I was!


    These kinds of issues, along with the fact that I don't want to double the amount of work for myself, unfortunately means I also can't "do both".

    It's either IE6 compatibility, or no IE6 compatibility.


    So, I guess the question comes down to "Are there few enough IE6 users amongst my target audience that I can happily forget about it?"

    Unfortunately these browser usage stats - particularly given the nature of the site that the sats come from - suggests far too many people still use IE6.

    And, my target audience, by the way, is 'gamers looking to buy a new PC' - which, while that doesn't rule out people using IE7/Firefox - probably means a large proportion of them will still be on IE6 - particularly given the prevalence of 'semi-legal' copies of XP amongst the gaming community.


    But still that forward-thinking purist in me nags away "that's sooo how not do it!". And then pragmatist pipes up "but think of all those people still using IE6"...

    And so it goes on...

    <*SIGH*>
    Last edited by Scorpion0x17; 10-20-2007 at 01:33 AM.

  • #6
    The fat guy next door VIPStephan's Avatar
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    Iím curious to see the design youíre intending to convert into a website. Iím sure itís easier than you think.

  • #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by VIPStephan View Post
    Iím curious to see the design youíre intending to convert into a website. Iím sure itís easier than you think.
    I don't actually have a 'design', in the sense that I think you're using the word in!

    Take a look at my old pandora-software site (that never really got anywhere) - that gives an idea of the basic 'look-and-feel' that I'm also going for with the new site.

    My background is in C++ coding and I'm aiming to produce almost a kind of 'content management system' where I can simply and easily drop blocks of content into a database and have them delivered, nicely laid-out and formatted...

    By the way, don't dig too deep into the code behind pandora-software - it's hideous - and isn't anything like the way I will be doing the new site - only the 'look-and-feel' will remain (it's all going to be done with PHP, in case you're wondering).

  • #8
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    I started learning how to make web site with CSS, I have never made a layout with tables and do not plan to. With that said I also make sure my CSS sites work in IE6, and to date it has never been a major problem. I am having a hard time imagining what these "advanced techniques" are that will not work in ie6. It seems more like it the reason in may not work in ie6 is because you are using the "wrong techniques".

  • #9
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    Exept where your page relies on CSS that IE6 does not understand, there is little problem in getting IE6 to display the same as other browsers. Where it is something that IE6 does not understand there is often an alternative that can be placed in an IE6 only stylesheet to produce the same effect.

    Probably will not be a problem in a couple of years time since most people now seem to be moving away from IE6 (about a 50/50 split between moving to IE7 and Firefox).
    Stephen
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    Don't forget to start your JavaScript code with "use strict"; which makes it easier to find errors in your code.

  • #10
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    Sorry, I'm probably not explaining myself very well.

    Basically my problems stem from the fact that I'm trying to create a system that will programatically generate html code.

    For page designs that I haven't yet even thought about, let alone worked out the HTML/CSS for.

    This requires a degree of flexibility and standardisation.

    It is that that is causing the problems.

    CSS2+ provides that flexibility, but IE6 is not fully compatible with CSS2+.

    So, you might think, "well, just avoid the CSS2+ features that IE6 is incompatible with, or only use those features in rules with selectors that IE6 ignores, or use some other hacks" or whatever...

    But, then you either remove a degree of flexibility or increase the complexity of implementing that fexibility.

    The question is not so much about a case of "can this layout/design be implemented in a manner compatible with IE6?" more "is it worth implementing my system in a way that is compatible with IE6?"

    No problem is insurmountable, but I have limited time and limited resources - I need to find the optimal use of that time and those resources.

    Quote Originally Posted by felgall View Post
    Exept where your page relies on CSS that IE6 does not understand
    Exactly! If I rely on CSS that IE6 does not understand, my system fails on IE6. It's that simple.
    Last edited by Scorpion0x17; 10-21-2007 at 03:32 AM.

  • #11
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    If you forget about IE6, you're forgetting about a large proportion of the userbase just at the moment.

    If you really must rely on styles that IE6 won't understand, I'd have to highly recomment serving a seperate and simpler version of the site through an ie6 specific stylesheet, which unfortunately mean programming in the ie6 hacks to your generator (effectively writing your css twice... once the standard way and the other the IE6 way, adding a conditional statement to the HTML.)

    I can certainly see your nightmare, but personally, I wouldn't ignore IE6.

  • #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by srule_ View Post
    I am having a hard time imagining what these "advanced techniques" are that will not work in ie6. It seems more like it the reason in may not work in ie6 is because you are using the "wrong techniques".
    Here you go!

    Now, maybe I'm overlooking something somewhere, but if someone can tell me how to get the results displayed under 'Version 2 - Table Based Frame - Variant 2', without using a table, in a way that will display correctly in IE6, I'd like to hear it.

    In fact, I can't even get the correct results in Firefox without using a table!
    (well, unless I float the container div - but I need to be able to use it on non-floating container divs - though, I guess in a sense that's 'correct' behaviour.)
    Last edited by Scorpion0x17; 10-22-2007 at 02:25 AM.


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