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  1. #1
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    Google stops censoring China

    Google Inc. on Monday began re-directing Internet traffic away from its Chinese-language site at google.cn to Hong Kong-based google.com.hk
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    Senior Coder tomws's Avatar
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    I disagree with much of Google's social/political leanings, but I admire a company that's willing to stand on its principles even in the face of potential revenue loss.
    Are you a Help Vampire?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomws View Post
    I disagree with much of Google's social/political leanings, but I admire a company that's willing to stand on its principles even in the face of potential revenue loss.
    The way I interpreted that page was more that it was a way to protect themselves, or was the attack mentioned not related to something intrinsic to their filtering system?

    Google announced in January that it had traced a sophisticated cyber-attack to China, and as a result would no longer filter results in its Chinese search service.

  • #4
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    Google was not the only company attacked. The attacks were partly to obtain information about Chinese dissidents which Google defiantly protects. Microsoft, one of the attacked companies too, apparently has no problem with that and chooses to remain.

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    Regular Coder brad211987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drhowarddrfine View Post
    Google was not the only company attacked. The attacks were partly to obtain information about Chinese dissidents which Google defiantly protects. Microsoft, one of the attacked companies too, apparently has no problem with that and chooses to remain.
    Never one to resist a Microsoft jab! But why no jab at the list of other companies?

    While I agree, its still a difficult decision to cut out 50% of the worlds population. And to be honest, Google didn't pull out of China strictly on principal, if that were the case, they wouldn't have had a search engine that filtered its results to begin with. Thats just publicity, and good publicity at that. Glad they pulled out of China like they said they would anyway, as China needs to loosen its grip.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brad211987 View Post
    Never one to resist a Microsoft jab! But why no jab at the list of other companies?
    Cause I don't recall who the others were. I think Yahoo might have been one but Yahoo has not made any comment yet. Microsoft, however, is the only company that puts out PR of their support for China's filtering, afaik.
    While I agree, its still a difficult decision to cut out 50% of the worlds population.
    Actually, only a small percentage of them have access to computers or the internet.
    And to be honest, Google didn't pull out of China strictly on principal, if that were the case, they wouldn't have had a search engine that filtered its results to begin with.
    First was the search engine. Filtering came later and with reluctance. Google was the last major search engine to put filtering in place and they stated from the beginning they were not happy about it but were required to by law. They were hoping free speech would win out eventually.

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    The Apostate Apostropartheid's Avatar
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    It's still a large market. And it's still money.

    I think the free speech thing is just a positive spin on their retreat from the market. It's obviously not the reason they're pulling out. D'you think they still run AdSense? It probably loses a lot of its value without the search engine backing it.

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    Regular Coder brad211987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drhowarddrfine View Post
    Actually, only a small percentage of them have access to computers or the internet.
    No doubt, but this also accounts for the largest upside potential customer base in the world.

    First was the search engine. Filtering came later and with reluctance. Google was the last major search engine to put filtering in place and they stated from the beginning they were not happy about it but were required to by law. They were hoping free speech would win out eventually.
    As long as they weren't happy about violating their principals I guess it's OK. In any event, its a shame China didn't come around but even Google knew that was a slim to none chance.

    My guess would be that adsense will be pulled as well, but I've not seen anything referencing that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Apostropartheid View Post
    I think the free speech thing is just a positive spin on their retreat from the market. It's obviously not the reason they're pulling out.
    You don't think the attempts to get into their email system was part of it?

    If you read the book "Googled" or somesuch, you'll find Google is not a company that lets profits drive their philosophy and the author was on David Rose a while back where he mentioned he wouldn't be surprised to see Google pull out for philosophical reasons and money would not hold them back.

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    Regular Coder brad211987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drhowarddrfine View Post
    You don't think the attempts to get into their email system was part of it?

    If you read the book "Googled" or somesuch, you'll find Google is not a company that lets profits drive their philosophy and the author was on David Rose a while back where he mentioned he wouldn't be surprised to see Google pull out for philosophical reasons and money would not hold them back.
    It's not a coincidence that they happen to decide to stand on their principals immediately following the attack. Google is a company very much like any other, they are most certainly driven by revenue and profit. It's profit that allows them to continue changing the world as they do, and that is not a bad thing. I've worked closely with their Google Apps team on many occasions, like any other part of their company, they are quite talented, but they are absolutely out to make money in the long run. As well they should be.

    As for China, Google is sugar coating the pull out with talks of principals, and doing it quite well. If they had decided to pull out of China with no inciting event to speak of, then I'd be OK with their reason, but thats just simply not how it happened.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brad211987 View Post
    It's not a coincidence that they happen to decide to stand on their principals immediately following the attack.
    The straw that broke the camel's back?
    Google is a company very much like any other, they are most certainly driven by revenue and profit.
    If you read the book I mentioned, or watched any of the author interviews, you'll find it's quite different how Sergey, Brin and Schmidt view such things.
    As for China, Google is sugar coating the pull out with talks of principals
    Why do you say Google needs to sugar coat it? I don't understand that at all.

  • #12
    The Apostate Apostropartheid's Avatar
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    Because Google can't actually prove that China acted against them/pointing it out would hurt relations. They needed another reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drhowarddrfine View Post
    you'll find Google is not a company that lets profits drive their philosophy
    Totally believeable. They have shareholders, hence they're profit driven. Google are no different to any other large corporation. If there's no fiscal value in it for them, they won't do it. Even the stuff which appears to have no value always has some form of value, whether it be just good publicity or otherwise.

    To put it in terms you'll appreciate, they're like M$ but less crap at everything they do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Apostropartheid View Post
    Because Google can't actually prove that China acted against them/pointing it out would hurt relations. They needed another reason.
    Why do they need a reason? Why would they want to leave and need to make this up? That doesn't make any sense. Under what pretense are you saying Google is acting and what is the reason behind it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattF View Post
    Google are no different to any other large corporation.
    I repeat. If you read the book and see the Charlie Rose interviews, you'll see they are not the same.

    btw, the book is fact filled but plodding and boring. No adventure story there. I could not finish it for those reasons.


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