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View Full Version : What's so bad about Macintosh comps?



yamoo
05-18-2005, 09:16 PM
I've asked a lot of people why people dislikes mac so much, and the worst thing they came up with, was that some guy had a hard time networking them ( :| ), and that macs don't have a trillion games; like the PC does.


I have been spending past few weeks thinking about mac, and the worst thing I could think of, is that it doesn't have 80 rows of games at the computer store.

I might get a mac some day, and before I buy one, can some one please post list all of the good & bad thing about it?

Thanks :)

yamoo
05-18-2005, 09:18 PM
Sorry! I thought this was in computer disscusion!

Can the mods please move this?

Basscyst
05-18-2005, 09:31 PM
Nothing, it's a matter of familiararity for me. They are nice systems. They especially have a 1 up cosmetically.

Basscyst

jkd
05-18-2005, 09:35 PM
I haven't had any more difficulty networking my mac than I have my windows or linux machines.

I only play games like Warcraft 3 or WoW or Jedi Academy, so the Mac platform doesn't make a difference.

And in reality, I prefer OSX to Windows XP. So, I don't consider it an inferior platform. It's not substantially greater than Windows though, it's just another platform that works.

Consider the thread moved, btw.

Spookster
05-19-2005, 12:27 AM
My biggest issues with them are that they are too expensive. Also all the Macs I have had to work with in the past crashed alot and the way they designed the inside of the desktop macs was horrible. On an older one I had to practically disassemble everything inside of it just to get to the memory cards to add another one. Overall I found the OS to be too much of a pain. Even worse than working with some of the Microsoft pre-WinXP OSs.

As far as networking we had quite a bit of problems trying to get that appletalk crud to work well on windows domain networks. When it did work it had a tendency to cause the Mac to crash and lock up.

JamieR
05-19-2005, 12:32 AM
Yeah, I've always found Macs far too expensive. I'm a 15 year old student, and I want a Mac. I heard from Geoffers that you only get something like 9% off every Mac purchase under a student licence. For 600 I could build myself a much higher spec Windows PC than I could purchase from Apple.

jkd
05-19-2005, 01:59 AM
Powerbooks are discounted $200 off the base price and every extra component is 10% off, using a student discount.

Apple before OSX was crap, I'll fully agree. OS9 locked up more than Windows 95, and ones before that even more. But they really did something right with OSX. :)

JamieR
05-19-2005, 02:45 PM
Something like that...is it true that if you purchase under an academic licence you get around 9% off *and* you don't pay VAT?

bcarl314
05-19-2005, 02:57 PM
MACINTOSH = Most Applications Crash, If Not, The Operating System Hangs. :D

Ok, all joking aside, to me the biggest problems with Macs are their price. I just can't justify spending $1500+ on a home computer when I can get a Dell for $500. I mean really, I could get one PC computer for everyone in my family for a little more than the price of 1 Mac.

But, a BIG (and I mean big) plus is that it's not going to run windows. I've got three computers at home now, one running WinXP Home and the other 2 are Linux / Unix boxen. My windows box is a POS. Crashes about every 3 days, and constantly needs to be rebooted. Although, it may be partly my fault, I actually install the "security updates" from microsoft and everytime I do, the system gets more and more hosed.

Funny, I run a security update on my Mandrake box (which doubles as my mail, web, file and print server) restart some services and I'm done. In fact, I just checked my uptime:



08:07:07 up 101 days, 18:14, 2 users, load average: 0.08, 0.02, 0.01


Not bad - 101 days! ;)

Where was I, oh yeah Macs. Another benefits that Macs have over PCs is their system architecture, which is more stable than a PCs architecture. They also have fantastic graphic rendering capabilities.

My thoughts.

JamieR
05-19-2005, 04:00 PM
Apart from the price, the only other thing I don't really like about macs is the amount of freeware around for it. I think there is a higher amount of freeware around for windows as it is *easier* to write than Mac software.

oracleguy
05-20-2005, 06:08 PM
But, a BIG (and I mean big) plus is that it's not going to run windows. I've got three computers at home now, one running WinXP Home and the other 2 are Linux / Unix boxen. My windows box is a POS. Crashes about every 3 days, and constantly needs to be rebooted. Although, it may be partly my fault, I actually install the "security updates" from microsoft and everytime I do, the system gets more and more hosed.


I dunno, my main computer running XP, I just rebooted for some reason, forget what but it had been up without a reboot for 31 days.



Where was I, oh yeah Macs. Another benefits that Macs have over PCs is their system architecture, which is more stable than a PCs architecture. They also have fantastic graphic rendering capabilities.

That is because of the sheer fact that Apple refuses to let anyone else build the components for their computers, because if they did, they couldn't sell you a 500 dollar computer for 1500. So a result from this is that all the components are designed to work together, now obviously the PC components are too but each company might make subtle differences that can potentially impact the system stability. Plus then the OS has to use a bunch of different drivers for everything.

whackaxe
05-20-2005, 08:34 PM
the only barrier to my future mac is money. other than that i'm more than impatient to try OSX

rynox
05-20-2005, 09:13 PM
Geeks like me dislike Macs because we find their simplicity offensive. :rolleyes:

JamieR
05-20-2005, 09:34 PM
Geeks like me dislike Macs because we find their simplicity offensive. :rolleyes:

Lol! I want a new mac...I have one but it doesn't work :mad: :|

whackaxe
05-20-2005, 10:28 PM
Geeks like me dislike Macs because we find their simplicity offensive. :rolleyes:

you must have removed all the keys from your keyboard except 1 and 0 then :D

Skyzyx
05-20-2005, 11:52 PM
The whole price argument is simply no longer true. If you get a new Mac, and a comparably equipped PC, you're looking at the exact same price range. If you want to go spend $500 on a piece of crap Dell/HP/Whatever, you can take that same amount of money and buy a new Mac mini, as they too are comparably equipped.

You've got to remember that the PowerPC chip is RISC, while Intels are still CISC. Macs can do more in fewer clock cycles than PC's, hence the difference in clock cycles. Also, with less third-party vendors to worry about, the system tends to be more stable and use fewer resources in general, hence less of a need for more powerful hardware for a similar overall experience.

As far as geekiness goes, Mac OS X is based on NeXTStep technology, which is based on modern versions of Mach and BSD Unicies. You don't get geekier than Unix, sorry. In terms of freeware and software in general, you may have 10 word processing apps for Windows, but only 3 for Mac. How many apps are you really gonna use? In terms of games, most popular Windows games are ported to Mac within a year. Secondly there's, like, a million first person shooters out there. Can you really not live without the most recent game in an ocean of others nearly identical to it? No, really...

Also, although there's technically fewer software titles for the Mac, the overall quality of the software is generally better. Developers (in my experience) tend to be more attentive to their users than in the Windows world.

Lastly, you have Mac OS X. Vastly superior in some ways, moderately superior in others. I've never had a problem doing anything on my Mac that I used to do on my PC. I've got a monster of a PC, and a year-old 17" PowerBook. I'd never used Mac OS X before last June, and I picked it up in a matter of 5 minutes. It just feels better than Windows does.

As opposed to those who are die-hard one way or the other (and therefore tend to be ignorant and "religious" about their own platform), I've been using Macs for about 11 years (System 2.0 - OSX 10.4), and DOS/Windows for 10 years (DOS 4.0-7.x; Windows 3.1 - XP). I'm completely fluent and a power-user on both (all 3 including OS9) platforms. I use a different computer based on the task, but in general, Mac is simply a better platform, and I really see it ramping up in the next few years.

Don't hate it until you've given it a worthwhile and unbiased look for a couple of weeks.


Geeks like me dislike Macs because we find their simplicity offensive. :rolleyes:

So, you're more into B&D? S&M? :D

Basscyst
05-21-2005, 02:23 AM
Well, this kinda relates so I'll talk about it here. I was watching Pirates of Silicon Valley last night on TNT, I hadn't seen it, just happen to come on at like 2 am. Now, I won't go on about the movie or it's inaccuracies, but it did bring me back to my Mac Plus days. I loved that thing, and it was really the foundation of my PC experience. I didn't even get a windows box until about 1995 (yeah I was still using the mac plus). Aside from the color screen and the lack of games, I could really see little difference in the performance of the fancy new windows machines until windows 95 came out. I remember my buddy got a ultra fast 486 dx2 with some cheesy racing game with a digitized prize announcer (anyone remember that). The kicker though was Doom ( the game of all games ). That swayed me over to the other side. There really was a time when MS had a few legs up over Mac IMO, but they have come back in strides, and I think have a very nice little nitch in the market place.

Basscyst

whackaxe
05-21-2005, 11:52 AM
The whole price argument is simply no longer true. If you get a new Mac, and a comparably equipped PC, you're looking at the exact same price range. If you want to go spend $500 on a piece of crap Dell/HP/Whatever, you can take that same amount of money and buy a new Mac mini, as they too are comparably equipped.

Exactly :) My friends say that buying the cheapest mac (the mini) is lame when you can get a better performance PC. i just tell them that a 500$ mac is still a mac :D mind you, you can easily inflate a mac mini to 1000$ with just a few upgrades (on the mac store they even suggest you buy an iPod to with your mini, which costs the same price as the mini itself)

yamoo
05-23-2005, 05:14 AM
Thanks for your replies every one :)


I have a qeustion about the iMac G5, does it support Cat-5 Network cables?

JamieR
05-23-2005, 09:46 AM
Yeah I think it does :)

ChronicleX.com
05-24-2005, 03:20 PM
lol the age long war

AMD vs pentium

mac vs PC

Bill Posters
05-24-2005, 03:35 PM
lol the age long war

AMD vs pentium

mac vs PC

daddy vs chips

obiwanjabroni
05-24-2005, 04:18 PM
RISC processors are the way to go. I'll forgo most of the debate by saying OSX is absolutely brilliant (and a huge step in promoting Unix based OS's). And I must say, most of my experience with MACs in the past has been from OS7 to OS9, all of them single-threaded, all of them locking up on Word, a few times even Simpletext, but then OSX came out, and my life became easier.

I opt for the PC, however, simple because I like to build my own computer (need a gaming computer? I can build you one for 350, 380 if you want keyboard and mouse - that's right, $350 includes a 17" monitor). That's really where the pricepoint happens. In fact, I'll even give you the specs on that $350 PC - Athlon Sempron 2700+, Chaintech Mobo, Radeon 9600 Pro, 512 DDR SDRAM, Monitor. But anyway,

In terms of computer architecture, I have no problems with either. Most complaints about MACs previously was operating system, and now, there is no excuse. If you do complain about mac hardware, complain about price.

In other tech news:
XBox 360 equipped with a triple core custom build PowerPC main chip by IBM - that's right, 3 3.2 GHz PowerPC Processers
PS3 equipped with Cell Microprocessor by IBM and Toshiba - that's right, 1 3.2 GHz Controller + 8 3.2 GHz cores that subdivide and distribute processes over network to other idle PS3's.

Bill Posters
05-24-2005, 04:21 PM
I opt for the PC, however, simple because I like to build my own computer (need a gaming computer?
Subtle. ;)

ChronicleX.com
05-24-2005, 05:01 PM
daddy vs chips


Chips :D

JamieR
05-24-2005, 05:04 PM
nah.....IMO OS X is far superior to Windows in terms of stability. Also i think OS X looks better than Windows XP in UI design :p

Hrm...........Sausages, not chips - or both :p-:D

ChronicleX.com
05-24-2005, 05:04 PM
RISC processors are the way to go. I'll forgo most of the debate by saying OSX is absolutely brilliant (and a huge step in promoting Unix based OS's). And I must say, most of my experience with MACs in the past has been from OS7 to OS9, all of them single-threaded, all of them locking up on Word, a few times even Simpletext, but then OSX came out, and my life became easier.

I opt for the PC, however, simple because I like to build my own computer (need a gaming computer? I can build you one for 350, 380 if you want keyboard and mouse - that's right, $350 includes a 17" monitor). That's really where the pricepoint happens. In fact, I'll even give you the specs on that $350 PC - Athlon Sempron 2700+, Chaintech Mobo, Radeon 9600 Pro, 512 DDR SDRAM, Monitor. But anyway,

In terms of computer architecture, I have no problems with either. Most complaints about MACs previously was operating system, and now, there is no excuse. If you do complain about mac hardware, complain about price.

In other tech news:
XBox 360 equipped with a triple core custom build PowerPC main chip by IBM - that's right, 3 3.2 GHz PowerPC Processers
PS3 equipped with Cell Microprocessor by IBM and Toshiba - that's right, 1 3.2 GHz Controller + 8 3.2 GHz cores that subdivide and distribute processes over network to other idle PS3's.

the 360 is not the next level of consoles from MS. But the ps3 is sonys next level xbox2 will be the next level for MS.


i did not read all of your messages just yet sorry if there are any missunderstandings

done in 5 secs :D

bauhsoj
05-25-2005, 05:41 PM
I used to have a Mac but then I switched to Windows because I simply couldn't afford to buy a new Mac on my student budget at the time and the fact that there were no good RAD programming tools on the Mac while there was Visual Studio on Windows (which my school required anyway...only had the CodeWarrior IDE on Mac).

I just built my latest Windows PC and still wish I could get myself another Mac. Now however, the only reason I have become interested in getting a Mac again is because of Apple's Xcode programming environment so that I can learn Objective-C without having to deal with GNUstep on Windows. Compared to Xcode, Visual Studio is a ******* dispensing addictive migraine pills (if you have tried applying the MSDN code examples as given, you may understand what I mean). About a year ago I had to drop Visual Studio entirely (too much lost productivity) in favor of writing nothing but PHP and Java. Objective-C is my next language to tackle but I would much rather learn it using Xcode and Cocoa.

Read this about Xcode (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xcode) and you may understand why I am so interested. Especially about the Rich Objects available through Cocoa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocoa_%28API%29).

whackaxe
05-25-2005, 06:20 PM
the 360 is not the next level of consoles from MS. But the ps3 is sonys next level xbox2 will be the next level for MS.

not to mention a new level of supra powered miniaturized next gen prices tags which run really silently when in the shop. the only time they become really noisy is when "the wife" is running in the background and conflicts with price tag setting off a loud buzzing noise some call "divorce threat".

400$ is a lot of green, but then again the console market is aiming at a higher age group these days

gsnedders
05-25-2005, 06:47 PM
the 360 is not the next level of consoles from MS. But the ps3 is sonys next level xbox2 will be the next level for MS.
The Xbox 360 is MS's next gen console, find one thing on the MS website that backs up what you say. Almost everything at http://www.xbox.com/ says that the Xbox 360 is their next-gen console.


As for Objective-C, try and get your hands on NeXTSTEP, as the developer tools on OS X are based on these.

jkd
05-25-2005, 08:24 PM
People always forget the Revolution... bah. It also uses Cell processors. But that is a different story... I'm going to start a thread about it. :)

singedpiper
05-30-2005, 05:12 AM
so, my mac feelings are...

they are a horizontal monopoly
they have a greatly reduced software suite (don't lie, its true)
the amount and diversity of freeware available is laughable
the most immersive games don't exist on them
hard to upgrade
impossible to custom build
and finally,
if you want to argue that osx is geeky because its unix, use real unix, not some blunt edged candy coated child safety tamperproof bottle version.

I use windows (along with linux, and free BSD, and sun - choose your box) because for software and hardware customization to fit my changing needs it is flexible. macs are NOT. (PERIOD) there is no arguing that.

squirellplaying
05-30-2005, 06:16 AM
Basscyst, have you ever heard/seen ... Brian Regan. He does a whole section on plurals and one of the jokes is boxen.

Personally, I'd rather take $600, get a nice PC without windows and put ubuntu on it. Then I can pay the $5(is it up to $15 now?) and get Cedega and play almost any game I want.

gsnedders
05-30-2005, 04:21 PM
so, my mac feelings are...

they are a horizontal monopoly
they have a greatly reduced software suite (don't lie, its true)
the amount and diversity of freeware available is laughable
the most immersive games don't exist on them
hard to upgrade
impossible to custom build
and finally,
if you want to argue that osx is geeky because its unix, use real unix, not some blunt edged candy coated child safety tamperproof bottle version.

I use windows (along with linux, and free BSD, and sun - choose your box) because for software and hardware customization to fit my changing needs it is flexible. macs are NOT. (PERIOD) there is no arguing that.

Tell me a piece of software which you actually use, which isn't available on Mac.

What? Doom 3, The Sims 2, World of Warcraft, Myst IV, Halo... Are they not immersive?

Hard to upgrade? I recently upgraded the RAM on a PowerMac G5 and I didn't need any tools. Same goes for the iMac G3 and PowerBook G4 among others.

Sure, they are impossible to custom build, but that contributes to greater stability, as they run on a limited set of ccomputers, so it is possible to test the OSes on all the computers that it can run on.

JamieR
05-30-2005, 08:08 PM
Hard to upgrade? I recently upgraded the RAM on a PowerMac G5 and I didn't need any tools. Same goes for the iMac G3 and PowerBook G4 among others.


You installed an extra 4GB of ram in your Powermac G5 ages ago :p
--
One thing I find frustrating about macs is there isn't as much freeware for mac as there is windows.

Also I can think of quite a few programs which aren't available in mac versions ;)

gsnedders
05-30-2005, 08:09 PM
You installed an extra 4GB of ram in your Powermac G5 ages ago :p
Ya.. Decemeber :p

JamieR
05-30-2005, 08:10 PM
Holy hell you respond fast...:D

singedpiper
05-30-2005, 09:13 PM
Doom 3 was pathetic, the AI was just sad. they tried to make up for a lack of plot and repetetive action with gloomy graphics that were still too plastic.

lets see, how about:
HALF LIFE 2

the best fps I've ever played. that was a game where the scary parts were scary ("oh God..." - Ravenholm)

anyway, serious upgrades are still difficult, upgrading ram is nothing.

singedpiper
05-30-2005, 09:14 PM
also, most of the mac versions have stinted graphics or physics, or have major glitches, because most mac versions of games are horrible ports.

gsnedders
05-31-2005, 12:24 AM
Doom 3 was pathetic, the AI was just sad. they tried to make up for a lack of plot and repetetive action with gloomy graphics that were still too plastic.

lets see, how about:
HALF LIFE 2

the best fps I've ever played. that was a game where the scary parts were scary ("oh God..." - Ravenholm)

anyway, serious upgrades are still difficult, upgrading ram is nothing.

Well Half Life 2 isn't being ported because Valve are asking for a huge amount of money for the port. I have to agree however, that many ports are just rubbish. In my experience the OpenGL isn't really that bad...

Well, having looked in the PowerMac G5 manual, both Hard Drive and DVD drive can be changed with 4 screws, and both look rather simple to upgrade, PCI and AGP are also very easy to add/replace... Processor upgrades? Currently don't exist for G5s yet, but I can say they were easy in PowerMac G3s and G4s...

JamieR
05-31-2005, 01:18 AM
Processor upgrades? Currently don't exist for G5s yet, but I can say they were easy in PowerMac G3s and G4s...

Not even from a 2.5ghz PPC G5 to a 2.7Ghz?

gsnedders
05-31-2005, 03:19 AM
Not even from a 2.5ghz PPC G5 to a 2.7Ghz?
Nope - No G5s upgrades as of yet.

kalosneri
05-31-2005, 03:59 AM
actually, mac is great for graphic designer.

JamieR
05-31-2005, 12:25 PM
actually, mac is great for graphic designer.

But why? You can still run stuff like Adobe Creative Suite on Windows ;)

gsnedders
05-31-2005, 07:49 PM
But why? You can still run stuff like Adobe Creative Suite on Windows ;)
Speed and stability.

JamieR
05-31-2005, 07:51 PM
True...but I run it on my 2ghz Laptop with 512MB ram and it runs fine for me...stable and fast. However I want more ram in there :D



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