Woah nessy! Firefox be trippin' out...

Indeed what the title says. Firefox trips out when I mouse over any sort of :hover-attached element on this page:

http://staff.faithfocus.org/galleries/

Is it just me, or do the captions duplicate themselves and align to the top left of the menu?

Any ideas what would cause this? It validates (CSS doesn't, but that's because I use -moz-border-radius) so I've no clue.

It's a long shot, but maybe someone's had something similar happen. I'm almost prepared to just live with it.

Thanks for any suggestions,
Aaron

Woah Nessy! Site be offline :(

Odd...

It's up for me now... I didn't notice any downtime. Still down on your end?

It seems to be the overflow: auto; in the following rule causing this.

#gallery div.caption {
margin-top: 5px;
text-align: left;
height: 60px;
overflow: auto;
}

Aye, you're right. But I _need_ that rule because I can't be sure of the height of those captions, so I just make them scrollable.

Suppose I should just live with it until Firefox fixes the bug. Does Mozilla do it, anyone?

Thanks Mark :)

Mozilla 1.7: does the bug dance :(

Moz1.7 and ff0.10 are kept unified, so it has to be a very specific bug for only one of them to exhibit it. Especially when it comes to rendering.

Class names that refer to colors or other visual renderings are bad juju, man...

There is a not-all-that-uncommon bug like this with IE. Perhaps finding some documentation of that well lead to a solution here?

Yeah, I noticed my class names yesterday and thought "Wait, what? Those should be .odd and .even." .blue and .beige were just the first things I wrote, and they stuck :S

As for documentation on the bug, I'm not sure exactly what to look for. Sure it's caused when the elements have overflow: auto on, but it's only visible when something's :hover is activated. Will definately try finding something, though I have this feeling their won't be much for a solution. Doesn't really bother me, as Moz and FF users are the type to keep updated, and it's only happening on one page.

(Perhaps this is new-thread-worthy, but why does CSS even have a :hover property? A :focus property? Shouldn't all this be done with the DOM? Not that I'm complaining!)

Oh, because there are powers in the CSS working group that want to extend it to non-processing behavior instead of just presentation. However, the pseudo elements do fill a niche that was necessary to be able to do all the styling that HTML needed. (Well, some are still missing, notably form controls, but in general...)

Yeah, I guess it doesn't really do any processing other than change styles when that event is called. Though I've no idea what IE's 'expression' property is fully capable of.

Heh, you've touched on an interesting topic, Aaron. I really like PPKs article on the subject: Seperating Behavior and Presentation (http://www.digital-web.com/articles/separating_behavior_and_presentation/)

It's an interesting situation because, as PPK points out in that article, CSS makes certain behavioral features very easy with a minimal amount of code so, one almost feels foolish to look away from that. Of course, as you cited, it's a violation of the seperation of those two layers.

Though... I must say, while the "hover" part of :hover obviously implies behavior, what it controls is still the presentation. You're not changing the document structure, you're not manipulating the UI or anything... you're changing a color or showing an element that was hidden, etc. So, I think it's like 75% presentation, 25% behavior... more than acceptable at this point.

As liorean mentioned, there are those that would have CSS containing even more power, processing and such. I have often desired to see such power within' it as well.

So, my thought: merge the two. You take presentation and behavior and you merge them into one layer apart from structure. It seems sound in theory.

They already are merged: document.object.style. I guess that's not really merged, but the DOM can access the CSS, and I guess :hover is CSS's way of accessing the DOM?

I don't think they should remove :hover, just found it odd that it's there and not separated. Since it only controls styles during certain events, it's probably even closer to 99% style. It's a selector that lets you select states of the object.

I guess technically if someone were really crazy about the behaviour/presentation/content layer separation, they could very well write their own DOM script to emulate it, and boycott the use of :hover and :active in favour of onmouseover and onfocus, etc.

They already are merged: document.object.style. I guess that's not really merged, but the DOM can access the CSS, and I guess :hover is CSS's way of accessing the DOM?

Hahaha... you just outlined how they are in fact NOT merged: THEY ARE TWO SEPERATE LANGUAGES, separate layers. I understand what you're saying, but it is not applicable to what I was talking about and advocating.

I don't think they should remove :hover

Who does??

For beginning coders (who will have no idea what the DOM is or that it even exists), the presence of the :hover dynamic pseudo-class will almost be a necessity to learn more. I think all of the dynamic pseudo-classes (:hover, :active, and :focus) should remain intact.

Yeah, I noticed my class names yesterday and thought "Wait, what? Those should be .odd and .even." .blue and .beige were just the first things I wrote, and they stuck :S

You what?!? I pointed that out about a month ago! :o

I don't remember us discussing that :S

But I did realize it the other day. I'd have changed it had you mentioned it that early on (or had I heard you mention it).