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eiger23
02-13-2012, 05:10 PM
I'm building my site but keeping in mind that I also want it to be able to be viewed on an iPad. Now I know most people say they hate Flash or that Flash shouldn't be part of websites because of the fact that a lot of people still haven't gotten with program and don't have Flash installed on their computers.

Most people say to use Javascript instead, but the there are those people that say don't risk using Javascript because a lot of people have it disabled, and it's buggy when it comes to old browsers.

I love working with Flash and I love working with Javascript, but I guess the only way to do a site that can combine these and work on a mobile device as well (ahem* ahem* iPad) is to just test and test and test on every platform and every browser. I'm just trying to differentiate myself from other websites out there and it's really difficult to without Flash.

What do you guys think?

mlseim
02-14-2012, 02:15 AM
I don't think Apple products (iPad, iPod, iPhone) support Flash?

Anyone that has javascripting disabled deserves the poor internet experience that they wish to have.
A lot of people don't have it disabled. Only the ones that visit sites and then wonder why they don't work.

PHP, AJAX, javascripting, JQuery ... all fine to use for online apps (mobile devices).

eiger23
02-14-2012, 03:39 PM
You're right they don't support Flash, and I had the same thoughts about people who don't have javascript enabled. But there is a lot of websites out there that have gotten high recognition and great criticism because they mostly use flash to give a unique and exciting website experience. Now i'm not saying you can't do this with Javascript, but Javascript always had bugs with different browsers where Flash plays solid with all of them as long as they have flash installed. But then what happens when you want to go on the website on an iPad.

See what I'm saying.

Apostropartheid
02-14-2012, 04:35 PM
You're right they don't support Flash, and I had the same thoughts about people who don't have javascript enabled. But there is a lot of websites out there that have gotten high recognition and great criticism because they mostly use flash to give a unique and exciting website experience. Now i'm not saying you can't do this with Javascript, but Javascript always had bugs with different browsers where Flash plays solid with all of them as long as they have flash installed. But then what happens when you want to go on the website on an iPad.

See what I'm saying.

If you're targeting the iPad, you have to forget about Flash, unless you want to double your development time. JavaScript libraries nowadays iron out the browser inconsistencies.

VIPStephan
02-14-2012, 05:27 PM
Anyone that has javascripting disabled deserves the poor internet experience that they wish to have.
A lot of people don't have it disabled. Only the ones that visit sites and then wonder why they don't work.

I’m sorry but what kind of attitude it this? There is no such thing as “poor internet experience” without JavaScript unless the developer is either lazy, or ignorant, or incompetent, or all of the above. The failure is not on the side of the people that “visit sites and then wonder why they don't work” but on the side of the people that develop websites that don’t work properly (because they don’t follow the principle of progressive enhancement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_enhancement)).

Now, that said: JavaScript can compensate most of the things that used to be done with Flash (besides Flash often being used for the wrong things anyway – it doesn’t get better if JS is just used as replacement for the bad practice Flash employed). Plus, in modern Webkit layout engines CSS3 transitions and animations are already at least partly supported in an experimental but fairly stable stage.

mlseim
02-14-2012, 08:44 PM
I guess you missed my point ... or I didn't convey it properly (probably the most likely) ...

A lot of sites use javascripting, JQuery, AJAX for a multitude of things.
If I turn off my javascripting, I should expect sites to not work (or look) proper.
By turning it off, I've agreed to have a bad experience, and I should expect it.

I realize a site developer should code properly for lack of javascripting, but
c'mon ... if someone has the knowledge to disable javascripting, that's their
problem, not the programmer. Should a programmer really spend the time to
script for the possibility of someone not using javascripting? I think not.


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