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View Full Version : About Google and China



drhowarddrfine
01-13-2010, 01:36 AM
For all the nonsense about "Google turning evil", Google said today (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2010/01/new-approach-to-china.html) that, due to attempts to hack into GMail of human rights activists from China, they are considering shutting down operations there.
These attacks and the surveillance they have uncovered--combined with the attempts over the past year to further limit free speech on the web--have led us to conclude that we should review the feasibility of our business operations in China. We have decided we are no longer willing to continue censoring our results on Google.cn

TheShaner
01-13-2010, 04:27 PM
Lol, you crack me up.

Praise be to Google! Let us take a moment and pay our respects to Google's internet omnipresent being and it's infallible judgments.

I am surprised that the dreadful Microsoft demon has yet to offer China their search engine and internet capabilities as a way to promote their communistic ideals, and have not opened up their email accounts to the Chinese government to root out the activists.

Hooray for fanboys and their typical posts, rehashing the same old arguments with illogical rationale.

No one said Google would turn evil. It was only conveyed by many others that blindly trusting a large corporation with so much power is naive. Like always, you love to misconstrue what is actually said by others. You hear what you want to hear and, in turn, run the same rants and posts day in and day out. Just because Google or any other corporation, business, human being, etc. is seemingly altruistic today, does not mean they will be tomorrow. If you want to faithfully trust Google, that is your own prerogative. Every one of us have people or things that we faithfully trust, be it our spouse, god, friends, businesses; however, just because we put our trust in it doesn't mean it can never be betrayed. We have all had someone close to us betray our trust. You're talking about a corporation that has no personal relationship with you. There is a big difference and I would sooner put my total and unwavering trust in a friend, family, or spouse before a corporation. I'm not saying that we should all be paranoid and wait for Google to make a misstep, but to say they will forever be infallible is ignorant, and I would fully expect a man of your age and experience would at least understand that.

-Shane

drhowarddrfine
01-13-2010, 06:16 PM
Lol, you crack me up.

No one said Google would turn evil. It was only conveyed by many othersI think you just cracked me up by contradicting yourself.

that blindly trusting a large corporation with so much power is naive.What's funnier is you presume and assume people do that. You are one of those people who automatically brand any large corporation as evil without facts, knowledge, proof, or evidence.
Like always, you love to misconstrue what is actually said by others.But....but...you just said it IS said by others!


You hear what you want to hearLike I said, you apparently heard Google can't be trusted from someone and somewhere and believed it to be true based on hearsay but no evidence. This is your basis for attacking what I said which IS based on evidence.


and, in turn, run the same rants and posts day in and day out.Who's doing the ranting? I can always count on you.


Just because Google or any other corporation, business, human being, etc. is seemingly altruistic today, does not mean they will be tomorrow. If you want to faithfully trust Google, that is your own prerogative.And you are running which OS? Did you register it with your name, etc.?


however, just because we put our trust in it doesn't mean it can never be betrayed.As I said in another thread which you have either forgotten or never read. Your preference is not to trust in the first place, apparently.


I'm not saying that we should all be paranoid and wait for Google to make a misstepThen what's your point? To jump all over this thread? I don't see what you're purpose here is.

but to say they will forever be infallible is ignorant, and I would fully expect a man of your age and experience would at least understand that.
Well, Shane, I didn't say that. If you can point out to where I did, I'll reply but if you are going to make up statements for me and purport that I said them, I would request that you get banned from this forum.

TheShaner
01-13-2010, 08:12 PM
I think you just cracked me up by contradicting yourself.
Don't half quote my statements and tell me I'm contradicting myself. Read both sentences again and maybe you'll understand. Believing a corporation is evil and believing a corporation is capable of faults are worlds apart and not contradictory.

You are one of those people who automatically brand any large corporation as evil without facts, knowledge, proof, or evidence.
I never said this. You just misconstrued my statements yet again. I said blindly trusting a corporation is naive. I NEVER said a large company is automatically evil. Please don't change what I say again. You said yourself that you are putting your trust in them:

You have to have trust in someone or something at one point. It is up to Google to lose that trust. They have not given any indication they will.
I used the adverb "blindly" to describe that you're putting your trust in an entity that you have no personal relationship with. Yes, we all have to put some level of trust with any corporation that handles our data. However, monopolies in the web could lead to more of your info becoming accessible to one entity. Your article link points out that Google does have some security vulnerabilities, albeit small ones that have been resolved. If Google monopolizes the web, a properly exposed vulnerability could lead to much more than your email and search habits hijacked. Same goes for if Google was to perform any illegal activity in the future (not saying they ever will - just saying that if it did happen), a monopolistic Google would hold all the keys.


Like I said, you apparently heard Google can't be trusted from someone and somewhere and believed it to be true based on hearsay but no evidence. This is your basis for attacking what I said which IS based on evidence.
No, my basis is that you're rehashing a previous debate. I trust Google as much as I trust any other web organizations that hold onto personally identifiable information.


Then what's your point? To jump all over this thread? I don't see what you're purpose here is.
If you're going to purposely bring back an old debate, then you better be able to handle one instead of crying about it.


Well, Shane, I didn't say that. If you can point out to where I did, I'll reply but if you are going to make up statements for me and purport that I said them, I would request that you get banned from this forum.
Yes, you did say that by means of this post:


but it would also suck if Google starts to control it
Why? Microsoft is a convicted monopolist. Google has never been brought into such things.
Funnymoney stated that it would suck if Google controlled the tech world, and you obviously have no problem with that based on your response, which means you must think they are infallible in order to trust Google with a monopoly. I think most people agree (which is reason for the debate in the previous thread that you rehashed) that any corporation, whether Google, MS, Yahoo, etc., having a monopolistic control of the tech/web world would not be desirable, as either a security breach or an illegal action by the company could result in a worldwide catastrophe.

I appreciate you not threatening me. If you cannot deal with my counterpoints, I suggest you post elsewhere then. As long as you're going to be purposely outspoken about your Google "fanboyism" and hatred for MS, you are going encounter individuals who may not agree on all of your posts. You should be used to it by now as you love to stir people up, but have trouble dealing with the repercussions.

-Shane

drhowarddrfine
01-13-2010, 08:59 PM
Well, Shaner, you say what Microsoft tells you to think cause you can't do it on your own so there's no arguing with you. I've told you that before and childish responses with attempts to bully cause you can't discuss intelligently are your trademark.

TheShaner
01-13-2010, 09:32 PM
Well, Shaner, you say what Microsoft tells you to think cause you can't do it on your own so there's no arguing with you.
This is another typical retort from you. When you have nothing to counter with, you accuse the person of being a "microsoftie" (as you did here (http://codingforums.com/showthread.php?p=891480)). I have not once EVER advocated Microsoft. Find proof if you can. My statements should not lead anyone to believe that I favor any software, web, or tech company. I would appreciate it if you addressed my responses, rather than slander me.


I've told you that before and childish responses with attempts to bully cause you can't discuss intelligently are your trademark.
Again, slandering me in no way validates any points of yours. You accuse me of bullying you, yet you threatened that you would ask for me to be banned based on not being able to find proof of a statement (for which I provided as asked). Who is doing the bullying again? All my responses and counterpoints have always been logical and intelligent, as are my supporting grammar and vocabulary used to express those opinions. In my line of work and with my past accolades, a lack of intelligence is something I do not suffer from ;)

-Shane

drhowarddrfine
01-13-2010, 11:35 PM
Yahoo backs Google response. (http://ajji.posterous.com/yahoo-backs-googles-response-to-china-hackers#)

brad211987
01-14-2010, 04:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShaner
Lol, you crack me up.

No one said Google would turn evil. It was only conveyed by many others
I think you just cracked me up by contradicting yourself.


A politician couldn't have done it better and so blatently.

Back on topic, I'm thrilled with Google's decision, filtering results never seemed like a very Google thing to do anyway. And for the debate, this is still no reason to blindly trust anything as Shane already clearly stated.

Before I get accused of being a "Microsoft Fanboy", its worth mentioning that I not only participate in a Google Apps reseller program but rely on gmail, docs, sites, chat, video, wave, reader, and too many more of Google's products to work every day. By no means do I, or should anyone distrust Google, and no one ever suggested that. As Shane mentioned, its just plain ignorant to view any corporation in such a way that you ignore the power they have, or could have.



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