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View Full Version : Firefox passes IE7 usage in Europe



drhowarddrfine
04-01-2009, 11:48 AM
In real news today:
Link (http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/03/firefox-3-marketshare-exceeds-internet-explorer-7-in-europe.ars)

Firefox 3 has finally surpassed Internet Explorer 7 as the most popular browser in Europe in a breakdown by version number.

levicki
04-01-2009, 03:50 PM
Good April Fools joke :D

VIPStephan
04-01-2009, 04:41 PM
Good April Fools joke :D

So… is it (http://gs.statcounter.com/#browser_version-eu-weekly-200904-200913)?

Fumigator
04-01-2009, 05:41 PM
Talk about skewing results... so useless to split IE6 and IE7 into separate lines. The second graph is the real story.

But I do [heart] FF3!

drhowarddrfine
04-01-2009, 06:50 PM
It's not a joke and they aren't skewing the lines. It's comparing FF3 to IE7 and not IE6 or FF2 for that matter.

For the past year I've been telling people that FF outpaced IE in parts of Europe, as well as Asia and Australia.

Fumigator
04-01-2009, 07:15 PM
It depends on what one wants to conclude. If you are trying to say "FF is used more than IE!", which you are, obviously, then the first graph makes it appear that statement is true. But the second graph shows clearly, IE is still used more than FF. So the statement "FF is used more than IE!" is actually false.

Compare the ratio of FF2 to FF3 and the ratio of IE6 to IE7-- more FF2 users have upgraded to FF3 than IE6 users have upgrade to IE7. This probably has a lot to do with the type of person who uses IE. People who don't want to be bothered with the browser war, people who don't even know there's a browser war, and people who don't upgrade, either because they aren't interested in upgrading or don't know enough to upgrade. My Mom, for example, would NEVER think to upgrade anything. She didn't really understand that IE isn't the "internet", though now she does use FF because I installed it and showed her the icon.

So yeah, that first graph SKEWS REALITY. Don't argue, you know I'm right. :p

drhowarddrfine
04-01-2009, 07:58 PM
If you are trying to say "FF is used more than IE!", which you areI am not. I said FF is used more than IE7. Actually, the title of the article says FF3 is used more than IE7.

I did say that FF outpaced IE in parts of Europe, Asia and Australia, though. That from a different source.

levicki
04-03-2009, 01:20 AM
You are missing the point as usual -- upgrade from FF2 to FF3 was forced for the majority of Firefox users (browser comes with auto-update turned on) which wasn't the case with IE6 to IE7 and IE7 to IE8 transition where the update was completely optional.

If Microsoft has used such irresponsible tactics without allowing users to test before deploying, they would have been sued into oblivion. But as usual open-source zealots can get away with it because they can't be held liable for their actions since the software they are peddling is free (as in beer).

drhowarddrfine
04-03-2009, 01:13 PM
You are missing the point as usual -- upgrade from FF2 to FF3 was forced for the majority of Firefox users (browser comes with auto-update turned on) which wasn't the case with IE6 to IE7 and IE7 to IE8 transition where the update was completely optional.No one forces you to do anything. You don't have to update to FF3 and, in case you didn't know, Windows Update is on by default, too. There are users on this board who are still using FF2, and you can still download and install it.

But as usual open-source zealots can get away with it because they can't be held liable for their actions since the software they are peddling is free (as in beer).
Are you aware that Microsoft force installs an add-on to Firefox on Windows without the user's knowledge and with no obvious means of uninstallation?

Again, you are complaining about something that's not true.

levicki
04-07-2009, 10:22 PM
No one forces you to do anything. You don't have to update to FF3 and, in case you didn't know

You know very well that inexperienced users will not fiddle with the upgrade options, and the default is to install all updates. So, it is as good as forced.


Windows Update is on by default, too.

True, but Windows Update != Internet Explorer update.

By default, only critical security hotfixes for the core OS comonents are being installed automatically via Windows Update.

However, major IE releases aren't critical but recommended updates so they don't get installed by default, not to mention that in large corporate environments update deployment process is controlled by the adminstrator, not by the end-user.

Lets summarize the above:

1. Firefox gets updated by default
2. Internet Explorer does not


There are users on this board who are still using FF2, and you can still download and install it.

Yes but you have to disable auto-update. Furthermore, the latest version of FF2 (2.0.0.20) is dated 18 December, 2008 meaning that security hotfixes released after that date aren't included.

Lets summarize the above:

1. By running FF2 you are running unpatched and thus insecure software
2. By running IE6 you are still getting critical security hotfixes for it via Windows Update

Now ask yourself again -- which upgrade path of the above two is forced?

To me it is a pretty clear that Mozilla is forcing major version upgrades by discontinuing support and security hotfixes for the old Firefox version. They are also pushing new features together with security updates so that you can't just take the security of FF3 and features of FF2.

On the other hand, Microsoft provides new features with IE7 (and now with IE8) but they still provide security updates to IE6 -- they understand that many people won't upgrade because the cost of doing so (not neccessary financial mind you) would be much higher than the perceived benefit from new functionality.

Finally, Mozilla is trying very hard to put the competition into the "feature chase" mode -- they seem to have learned from Microsoft how to do that.

Feature chase is when a company is setting the feature set of a typical application (and thus the customer expectations), and their competitors have to follow suit or risk losing the marketshare because "application ABC has feature XYZ and application DEF doesn't" no matter how ridiculous, useless, poorly researched, and poorly implemented feature XYZ actually is.


Are you aware that Microsoft force installs an add-on to Firefox on Windows without the user's knowledge and with no obvious means of uninstallation?

Those are just registry keys located under HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Mozilla\Firefox.

You are barking up the wrong tree -- if Mozilla didn't implement the key parsing, Microsoft could put anything in there and it would never show up in Firefox. But of course, your irrational hate for Microsoft doesn't let you see that Mozilla is the one to blame for allowing silent add-on installation, and for not providing an uninstall button.


Again, you are complaining about something that's not true.

I am not complaining -- I am just setting your facts straight.

DarkLightA
04-08-2009, 10:28 AM
Chrome has only 1.5%????

GO GOOGLE CHROME!

Millenia
04-08-2009, 02:44 PM
Google Chrome is much newer than most browsers. You can't expect the usage to be that high.
Plus, in my opinion, lots of features that people want in a browser are missing. It might be statistically fast, but I think people will stick with IE and FF for now at least because they are feature rich. The whole point of Chrome is it's minimalistic approach, but most people don't want that. I can't see the Chrome usage overtaking Firefox any time soon.

drhowarddrfine
04-08-2009, 04:32 PM
I am not complaining -- I am just setting your facts straight.
Lol! Says the guy who hasn't shown any fact and only guesses.



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